Starting December 2010, I have removed the contact info about my Contractors. Other than the chief Coordinator Ah Boy who has given me impressive coordination among his team then, his other team members have had some issue with regards to their work in other engagements.
While some have shared some info here, some of the problem remained unsolved as I wrote.
Now Ah Boy is still focusing mainly at plaster ceiling and office renovation work which is his primary domain. He no longer take up coordinator job with Ah Phan and Ah Fook.
In order not to mislead the readers, I therefore chose to remove all the contact info or even their photos.
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ReplyDeleteI have finalised the quotation for my house with Ah Phan... just waiting for Majlis approval to do the reno... my reno on structure only (without accessories) is about RM120k... after reading the above comment I am now very worry should the same thing happens to me... please advise before I proceed.
ReplyDeletealamsari
Dear Chris,
ReplyDeleteI will help you to contact BOTH Ah Phan and Ah Boy about the issue. Both of them has no history of running away from things, but the important thing is, if you read my first page, Ah Phan lost his phone, and I just listed out above his new Phone Number.
Do call him on his NEW phone, he asked me to put some note on my page, to help his clients to get back to him. He lost all contacts !
For Alamsari, you may do likewise. He has change his phone number.
Dear Chris, I just read about your blog. Sorry that there seems to have some disagreement between you and Ah Phan. Which is common in any given projects. But here's my advice in the issue:
ReplyDelete1. From my experience, Ah Phan do give relatively low building cost as compared to others. So sometimes its good if we stick to the construction plan, and let him finish the job. I know we as consumer do want to cut cost further (trust me on that), but there is a balance. Any changes in plan do involve in cost overlay.
2. Its good to follow up on our construction project. But since we are not reno-savvy like a pro-interior decorator, we won't see any problem until it is constructed right in front of our face. So I do take some design descrepancy as part of life. Any more changes will increase our cost. Ah Phan, from our experience, do change some stuff for 'free', but I think there will be a balance there.
3. While I do try to help up to a certain extent, I usually try not to get involved too much. I actually share my experience in house reno, but I am not part of their team.
4. I would encourage all that is interested to talk to the chief coordinator - Ah Boy, as he communicate better. You may not need to engage in plaster ceiling job by doing so. They work as a team. Ah Phan deal with brick works after coordinating with Ah Boy generally.
Dear Alamsari, he is very much contactable. And so is Ah Boy. From what I knew after talking to him just now, there need some communication betw Chris and himself. He is not running away.
thank you for kind explanation... for me Ah Phan is a mudah type of person, like him.
ReplyDeletealamsari
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ReplyDeleteHi there Chris, I assume both of you are the same person. After reading the latest reply, I immediately called up Ah Boy, who has no idea about not replying the call. Ah Boy has been busy, which I knew, till about a day ago. Some of my job is a little bit delayed as well due to his recent work commitment.
ReplyDeleteAfter I told him about your predicament, I suggest him to engagement both three of you for dialogue. In fact due to his work commitment, Ah Boy has left your house job entirely to Ah Phan's hand, so what actually happened to you is quite new to Ah Boy.
Anyway thanks for your sharing.
Another issue I need to remind is, both Ah Phan and Ah Boy has their own team. Although they do work together, but they both have their own team for specialised commitment. Perhaps thats why Ah Boy does not know about the latest development betw u and Ah Phan.
Meanwhile I have decided to remove their contact numbers from my blog, until such time that I deemed appropriate and necessary.
ReplyDeleteI really do hope to see solution between Chris and the contractors.
Hmmm, I was too unable to contact Phan for a few days. It drives me mad. He was doing up my condo minor renovation at Lorong Ceylon.
ReplyDeleteHe did to me what happen and explained knowing that he was an easy guy to deal with. Yeap, you were right cyt858, some of the stuff which I ask him to do was free.
Let me clarify this Chris, Im not standing at any ones sides. I assume you were the client he mentioned at Kota Kemuning. He said his workers (indon) were practically taken by you. Im not sure.
But by not helping anyone whether Phan or Chris, I would say it is really unethical to ask a contractor to quote, then talk to his workers and get lower price. Yea, thats what we owners usually want eh.. But think about it, we might just straight look for the indons instead of the chinese main cons..
Well, I think the reason he explain was his workers ( indon ) took away his cell phone as well.. cause I was really mad trying to contact him for a few days.
Well, you guys sort it out..Its not nice to undercut people..
Mr. Quek, thanks for sharing. Pls try to contact him again with his new contact number. I took away their phone no. for now until this thing sorted out. If you truly need his number, pls email me at cyt858@gmail.com .
ReplyDeleteI also heard a little bit about the issue betw Chris and Ah Phan. It seems that Ah Phan's staff has something to do with the whole issue. But without further evidence and proper dialogue, I won't want to flame further.
But dialogue betw Three parties is a must.
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ReplyDeleteThis comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
ReplyDeleteDear chris, I don't think he will treat you badly just because I remove the phone for now. You did not ask me to do it, I just do it at my own accord. I hope your dialogue with Ah Boy will continue until a quick solution appears. Do pray for solution as there is no solution to problem like this.
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ReplyDeleteMy plan has been approved and I have earlier on confirmed with Ah Phan that I've would hire him for the reno works.
ReplyDeleteBUT now, after reading what Chris have to say....I'm wavering as whether to employ him....
Hi Chris / Eagles' Wings, I've taken a look at your blog, picasa web photo album... all the reno works look very good quality. I can't seem to make out the slanted door frame on the photos of the rear of your house....the gap on the fence, the chain-link fence must be taken down b4 erecting the wall so that both sides can be plastered... did u discuss this concern with Ah Phan b4 the wall is completely erected?
Hi cyt858, what do u think I should do to better protect myself before really engaging Ah Phan to start work?
Get Ah Phan & Ah Boy together to meet up and discuss? Sign a work progress payment agreement?
I have not met Ah Boy before but he was the first I called around January 2010. But that time, Ah Boy needed to attend his brother's wedding and also I was eager to finalised on the contractor hunting, I called up Ah Phan. On one subsequent meet up with Ah Phan around CNY time frame, I did ask him why Ah Boy did not come with him. He said Ah Boy has been hospitalised after attending the wedding dinner...
cyt858, for my further evaluate ethicalness of Ah Boy / Ah Phan, would you help validate if this story is true if you could still recall?
Many thanks.
Dear CK,
ReplyDeleteWhat he said about Ah Boy's predicament about hospitalisation, and wedding is true. He was suspected of having dengue then after the wedding (we did call him up when he was in the hospital). As a result some of his works were delayed as well, which he apologise to us profusely.
I think the best is to engage Ah Boy together, that way, if Ah Phan is unable to pick up phone, u can also call up Ah Boy for confirmation. Ah Boy's team has tile layer, electrician etc. too., even his brother is helping him up etc.. So its very much a coordinated works.
However, since you have engaged Ah Phan, you may perhaps called Ah Boy up, talk to him about your concern, and ask for his opinion about it. It is possible that in your case, Ah Phan is doing the solo work.
But generally I would encourage you to engage both of them as a team. Two heads are always better than one.
Dear CK, after hearing Chris experience, its natural that you will feel that way.
ReplyDeleteOnce you confirm to go ahead with Ah Phan, you may device the timetable with him, that way its probably more secure. But do remember, whenever there is additional work done half way through the construction (which happened to everyone !) there will be delay overall.
Thx, cyt858. Your confirmation and reply really helped a lot.
ReplyDeleteI've called Ah Phan yesterday and today but I'll relate the story to you in a separate email.
Then, it's up to you whether to share my side of the story here.
The last thing I want is to hijack ur posting here and cause it to become a comment war....
Hi cyt858, just realised i don't have your email...Shall I just post it here?
ReplyDeleteCK,
ReplyDeletesince we are in the same boat (on this Ah Phan) if possible could you please share your story with me, btw I am Alamsari as you can read my post above. Tq
I'm at chema6768sa@yahoo.com
Alamsari
(have also finalising quotation with Ah Phan and awaiting MPKJ approval)
CK, here's my email: cyt858@gmail.com
ReplyDeleteUpon request by Chris, I have agreed to delete all her comments regarding her experience with the contractor. I hope she and the contractor can go on with life with lessons learned.
ReplyDeleteThanks for earlier sharing with us anyway.
I will also meet Ah Phan later on this week regarding some part of our house job for finalisation, I will also inform him about the deletion.
CK and Alamsari, pls share with us with through your new blog or here about your house job too.
I think we have to exercise extra cautions when dealing with some of these renovation contractors. They can be quite un-etiquette especially when money is concern.
ReplyDeleteI have the unfortunate experience of engaging one of the above mentioned contractor. Tiler by the name of Chin Thin Fook (Ah Fook). It was from this blog where I decided to engaged him instead of using my renovation contractor's tiler. A very costly mistake.
Meet up with Ah Fook in late Sept/ early October this year. Showed him the house and even gave him some dimensions for him to check out. We even meet up a few times at the house for him to verify a few things. I will supply all the tiles. After we have agreed on the price, he asked for a deposit of RM 1,000 claiming that this is so that the owner will not change his mind on engaging him when the time comes to start work. I agreed and paid him the money on 10 Oct. It was also agreed that he will finish up some of the tiling work for the bathrooms (one day's work). The major works are located on the ground floor.
On early Nov, he finally got someone (his friend) to do up the tiling work for my bathrooms (replacing some damaged wall and floor tiles)
When I asked him to proceed with the tiling work for the ground floor, he asked for 40% of the contract amount saying that this is the industrial norm. Well, since I was convinced that he is trustworthy and a no-nonsense guy, I gave him a cheque for another RM 2,800 on 2 Nov. He got his friend to start work on my kitchen wall. His friend with another helper only work for 3 days and did not turn up for work after that. That was after the cheque has cleared. During the few days his friend was working, there have been 2 incidents where there were claims for additional cost. I tried calling Ah Fook on his mobile the whole day. He did not answer. Finally when I managed to get him on his mobile, he claim that he cannot proceed with the work. I told him that since he is adamant that he is not willing to finish the job, then he should refund that balance of monies paid less the work done. He then claim that he will only refund RM 500 (although I did not agree that his work done justify RM 3,800 - 500 = 3,300)and asked for my bank account which I promptly gave him. After a few days with no sign of the refund from him, I called him. When I finally got him, he claim that he was busy to go to the bank and asked for a few more days. Now that the few days are up and he still has not bank in the money, I have not been able to get him on him mobile. he does not answer my calls.
Well, this is how contractors can be. When they want your money, they will promise everything and will even call you. So much for this bloody Ah Fook.
Khong, I am sorry to hear your experience. Last time when he did my house it was the coordinator that handled the payment job. So I did not have such bad experience. I do agree that contractor can be a difficult and at times, unpredictable people to work with.
ReplyDeleteFrom your note, it seems that Ah Fook did not manage to take up your job right from the beginning right? Is that why he handled down the job to his friend instead? He did not seem to do the job himself or by his team.
Sorry I did not see your message as I only log in this blog from time to time. Have you got your money already ?
repost message from khongts: (edited to hide personal phone no. etc. Sorry.)
ReplyDeleteHi cyt858,
I have been trying to get Ah Fook on his mobile (01*-8******)since last week; the date which he promised to bank in the money. He has not been answering any of my calls. There were 2 occasions where my call were answered; I can hear a lady's voice on the other side asking someone what to do... and the call were then abruptly cut off.
These are signs that he has no intention to return the money that he earlier promised (although it is lesser than what it should be)
I have even tried calling the fixed line number on the receipt that he issued to me. The line is not in service anymore.
I have checked with my guard house and obtained his particulars. Vehicle no. W*B**** White Proton and I/C no. 71*****. I have given instruction to prevent him from entering in the future.
[On a side note. When I was at the guard house, I was also told that another house owner had encountered a similar problem where her contractor ran away after taking some deposit] Contractors are getting unpredictable nowadays. But there are still some good contractors around; like my renovation contractor who has since got his tiler to finish up the tiling work abandoned by Ah Fook.
Looking back, there were tell tale signs during the few days his friend was working at my house.
-Claiming for additional money for work which should be covered in the original scope of work.
-They then kept revising the quantity of wall tile shortfall for the wet kitchen. (shortfall due to the way they laid the tiles) My wet kitchen is quite small. 8' x 7' with only three walls. We were given 3 different quantities. 1st, it was shortfall of 30pcs. It was then revised to 39pcs a few hours later when I asked them to confirm the quantity. In the evening, when I personally checked at the house, I calculated a shortfall of only 16 pcs. It does not take a genius to calc since the wall tiles are already 80% completed. The next morning, the tiler told my wife the shortfall is now 45 pcs.
As the tile shop is only able to supply the additional quantities on the next day of order, they took the opportunity to stop work. We have delivered all the tiles for other area and there are plenty of work on other areas.
Sorry Khong, although I don't sensor stuff here, I do think its not appropriate to reveal their personal no. here. I hope you can understand.
ReplyDeleteThe tile shortfall is part of the trade. During my reno, we actually bought our own tiles. So I buy tiles and he will anticipate the amount needed.. but the problem is sometimes the tiles can be defective, or broken during their work. Therefore they will always over-estimate. Till now I still have a small piles of unused tiles left behind due to over estimation. For me, it is better then project delay due to work delay.
I have also heard from others who did not get the job well done from Ah Phan (this is the first time I heard about ah Fook) too. I think in due course, I may have to delete this page in order not to give others wrong impression about the quality of the work.
By the way, Ah boy, my coordinator, went back to his original expertise of doing office reno and plaster ceiling job. He no longer works with other teams anymore.